# Emission rate of Grin

**URL:** <https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171>\
**Category:** Market\
**Created:** [February 8, 2018, 4:14pm UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171 "2018-02-08T16:14:01Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 20\
**Page:** 7

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**Author:** ![Paouky](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forum.grin.mw/paouky/32/513_2.png) [@Paouky](https://forum.grin.mw/u/Paouky)\
**Post date:** [December 11, 2018, 11:08am UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/125 "2018-12-11T11:08:57Z")

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@lehnberg I will certainly give it my best shot, glad to be of help somehow. I’ll post a draft this week.  
Keep in mind that English is a 2nd language to me so it would need some extra work.

_edit: I posted a rough draft in the wiki but I’m still working on it with the help of lehnberg._

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**Author:** ![Askepios](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forum.grin.mw/askepios/32/377_2.png) [@Askepios](https://forum.grin.mw/u/Askepios)\
**Post date:** [December 13, 2018, 5:08pm UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/126 "2018-12-13T17:08:31Z")

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I completely agree, and I think this is absolutely critical. Undoubtedly, the best medium to tell grins story is video. I’ve been thinking about this for sometime—a Grin documentary. I would love to be involved with such a project. I have experience with film, sound, editing, etc. The world needs to hear Grin’s story.

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**Author:** ![kargakis](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forum.grin.mw/kargakis/32/48_2.png) [@kargakis](https://forum.grin.mw/u/kargakis)\
**Post date:** [December 26, 2018, 8:33pm UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/127 "2018-12-26T20:33:34Z")

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Nick Szabo on fixed supply:

_I think a wide variety of supply algos would have worked, as long as they are predictable. […] Security/trust min is responsible for more of the value, as I assess it._

> <https://twitter.com/NickSzabo4/status/1077317105148547072>

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**Author:** ![bobbyk](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forum.grin.mw/bobbyk/32/754_2.png) [@bobbyk](https://forum.grin.mw/u/bobbyk)\
**Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 11:05pm UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/128 "2019-01-03T23:05:56Z")

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No deflation does not destroy a currency - inflation destroys the value of currency.

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**Author:** ![bobbyk](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forum.grin.mw/bobbyk/32/754_2.png) [@bobbyk](https://forum.grin.mw/u/bobbyk)\
**Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 11:47pm UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/129 "2019-01-03T23:47:44Z")

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Resets + history of USD:  
\<1900 - bimetalism, various coins/notes, private & govt issued since Hamilton’s time at Treasury

1900 - US moved to the gold standard, making both gold and silver the legal-tender coinage of the United States, and guaranteed the dollar as convertible to gold at a fixed rate

1913 - Federal Reserve established, loose monetary policy helps fuel 1920s bubble

1933 - suspension of gold standard

WWII until c. 1947 I believe - FED pledge to fix interest rate at low rate during wartime, despite high consumer price inflation esp. post-WWII

post-WWII Bretton Woods system - Under the post-WW II Bretton Woods system all currencies were valued in terms of U.S. dollars and the USD was backed by gold (exchangeable into gold) at $35 per troy ounce (112.53 ¢/g) market price of gold, as the conversion to foreign currencies caused economic and trade pressures. By the early 1960s, compensation for these pressures started to become too complicated to manage.

1971 - Nixon takes US off gold, Bretton Woods collapses, we enter fiat world with flexible & manipulated exchange rates, pressures on central banks to go independent of politicians

1970s+ - high inflation periods, major asset bubbles, dollar’s debasement accelerates.

2008-2018 saw the biggest increase in money supply in decades (USD, EUR, Yen, Renminbi/Yuan - printing press full on on those), I’d expect another reset to come around sooner rather than later. Maybe it’ll be a reset in policy/standards + substitution into other currencies & cryptocurrencies (Bitcoin, Grin!? 🙂 )

However, the USD post-WWII benefits much from being the global reserve currency as the entire world uses it as a medium of exchange and unit of account, also store of value relative to other weaker currencies, but CHF (Swiss Franc) & gold are much stronger as store of value. The US govt/economy gets seigniorage by having USD as global reserve currency. [Seigniorage Definition](https://www.investopedia.com/terms/s/seigniorage.asp) - because the USD is so highly in demand, increasing it’s supply is even easier for the US FED/government, vs a mid-size economy where the currency is in demand mostly by domestic businesses & consumers.

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**Author:** ![bobbyk](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forum.grin.mw/bobbyk/32/754_2.png) [@bobbyk](https://forum.grin.mw/u/bobbyk)\
**Post date:** [January 4, 2019, 12:05am UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/131 "2019-01-04T00:05:07Z")

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Really strong point!

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**Author:** ![thi](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forum.grin.mw/thi/32/249_2.png) [@thi](https://forum.grin.mw/u/thi)\
**Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 6:53pm UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/132 "2019-01-12T18:53:19Z")

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When I said “[to] destroy currency”, I meant “[to] destroy [units of a] currency” (not to “lower the unit’s price of a currency”).

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**Author:** ![bobbyk](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forum.grin.mw/bobbyk/32/754_2.png) [@bobbyk](https://forum.grin.mw/u/bobbyk)\
**Post date:** [January 14, 2019, 8:07pm UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/133 "2019-01-14T20:07:13Z")

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Cool that’s much clearer thanks much.

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**Author:** ![Roelsmajor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9dc877/32.png) [@Roelsmajor](https://forum.grin.mw/u/Roelsmajor)\
**Post date:** [February 3, 2019, 10:37am UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/134 "2019-02-03T10:37:17Z")

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Hello semuanya…  
Saya rasa rate emisi alias rate inflasi Grin sekarang ini terlalu besar. Saya sudah baca artikel [Grin Money Explained](https://medium.com/@CryptoProfG/grin-money-explained-4-exploring-grins-monetary-model-e48b1761653) dan Saya rasa seharusnya setelah satu tahun emisinya langsung diturunkan mengikuti emisi/inflasi Gold, atau sebagai alternatif bisa juga mengikuti emisi/inflasi Silver. Seperti yang dikatakan @mgbor memang tidak ada yang mengetahui nilai pasti inflasi Gold atau Silver, baru dikumpulkan di era modern ini setelah ada internet.

Melihat beberapa data dari internet yang Saya kumpulkan:

1. [http://goldstandardinstitute.net/2012/02/19/how-much-gold-stock-is-there-really/](http://goldstandardinstitute.net/2012/02/19/how-much-gold-stock-is-there-really/)
2. [https://www.gold.org/goldhub/data/historical-mine-production](https://www.gold.org/goldhub/data/historical-mine-production)
3. [Zerohedge](https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-03-01/visualizing-all-silver-world)
4. [Mine Production - The Silver Institute](https://www.silverinstitute.org/mine-production/)
5. [Alert: Gold-to-silver ratio spikes to highest level in 27 years! - MINING.COM](http://www.mining.com/web/alert-gold-silver-ratio-spikes-highest-level-27-years/)
6. [The Gold-Silver Ratio Explained Like Never Before – SRSrocco Report](https://srsroccoreport.com/the-gold-silver-ratio-explained-like-never-before/)

Saya berpendapat emisi/inflasi Gold berkisar hanya sekitar rataan 0.25% Per Tahun. Dari asumsi tersebut bisa diambil perhitungan bahwa rasio Gold dan Silver biasanya berkisar rata rata 1:11 , maka laju inflasi Silver bisa dikatakan 11x lebih besar dibanding Gold di angka 2.75%

Jadi emisi Grin jangka panjang akan mengikuti Silver, bukan Gold… 😁

Google translate:

Hello everyone …  
I think the current rate of emissions aka Grin’s inflation rate is too big. I have read the article [Grin Money Explained] ([https://medium.com/@CryptoProfG/grin-money-explained-4-exploring-grins-monetary-model-e48b1761653](https://medium.com/@CryptoProfG/grin-money-explained-4-exploring-grins-monetary-model-e48b1761653)) and I think that after one year the emission is immediately lowered following Gold emissions / inflation, or alternatively you can also follow Silver emissions / inflation. As @mgbor said, no one really knows the exact value of Gold or Silver inflation, just collected in this modern era after there was internet.

See some data from the internet that I collected:

1. [http://goldstandardinstitute.net/2012/02/19/how-much-gold-stock-is-there-really/](http://goldstandardinstitute.net/2012/02/19/how-much-gold-stock-is-there-really/)
2. [https://www.gold.org/goldhub/data/historical-mine-production](https://www.gold.org/goldhub/data/historical-mine-production)
3. [Zerohedge](https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-03-01/visualizing-all-silver-world)
4. [Mine Production - The Silver Institute](https://www.silverinstitute.org/mine-production/)
5. [Alert: Gold-to-silver ratio spikes to highest level in 27 years! - MINING.COM](http://www.mining.com/web/alert-gold-silver-ratio-spikes-highest-level-27-years/)
6. [The Gold-Silver Ratio Explained Like Never Before – SRSrocco Report](https://srsroccoreport.com/the-gold-silver-ratio-explained-like-never-before/)

I think Gold emission / inflation ranges only around an average of 0.25% per year. From these assumptions, it can be calculated that the Gold and Silver ratio usually ranges from 1:11, then the Silver inflation rate can be said to be 11x greater than Gold at 2.75%.

So long-term Grin emissions will follow Silver, not Gold …: grin:

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**Author:** ![FirsArgentum](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forum.grin.mw/firsargentum/32/736_2.png) [@FirsArgentum](https://forum.grin.mw/u/FirsArgentum)\
**Post date:** [February 3, 2019, 12:17pm UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/135 "2019-02-03T12:17:13Z")

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If I understand the basic principles at work, gold, being more of a store of value than used for currency, (these days, at least) that low inflation rate probably makes sense since you don’t want the value to inflate away. A currency, being meant to flow around the system as the name implies, can reasonably have a higher rate, as fiat currencies in practice have generally been found to have. If they didn’t people would be more inclined to hold on to them whereas you want people to spend them to keep commerce happening and give people a means of exchanging things of value. A rate similar to silver’s of around 2.75% seems reasonable. What seems less clear is how a currency would fair in practice if the emission rate is constant and has no mechanism for being manipulated - are there times when you might want to do this for benevolent reasons? A look at the USD money supply is interesting, if not alarming, to consider in this regard, partic. since the meltdown in 2008…

 ![image](https://canada1.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/uploads/grin/original/2X/0/09142119951bd2f257557e9481b8f9dc29aa6b69.png)  
Ref: [https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/money-supply-m0](https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/money-supply-m0)

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**Author:** ![sebseb7](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forum.grin.mw/sebseb7/32/581_2.png) [@sebseb7](https://forum.grin.mw/u/sebseb7)\
**Post date:** [February 3, 2019, 12:52pm UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/136 "2019-02-03T12:52:18Z")

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> [@mgbor](#):
>
> because once that happen it’ll take money out of the market in return bring the valuation down right

same for the 3% fee of the largest pool. it gets 2% of all of emission and thats more than available on the markets.

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**Author:** ![Chronos](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forum.grin.mw/chronos/32/153_2.png) [@Chronos](https://forum.grin.mw/u/Chronos)\
**Post date:** [February 3, 2019, 5:03pm UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/137 "2019-02-03T17:03:49Z")

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> [@Roelsmajor](#):
>
> From these assumptions, it can be calculated that the Gold and Silver ratio usually ranges from 1:11, then the Silver inflation rate can be said to be 11x greater than Gold at 2.75%.

Incorrect. The supply inflation rate has no correlation to the market price.

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**Author:** ![monkyyy](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forum.grin.mw/monkyyy/32/1590_2.png) [@monkyyy](https://forum.grin.mw/u/monkyyy)\
**Post date:** [February 3, 2019, 8:43pm UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/138 "2019-02-03T20:43:06Z")

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???

Since when does supply and demand not affect price?

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**Author:** ![MerlinsBeard](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forum.grin.mw/merlinsbeard/32/2863_2.png) [@MerlinsBeard](https://forum.grin.mw/u/MerlinsBeard)\
**Post date:** [February 4, 2019, 4:28pm UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/139 "2019-02-04T16:28:04Z")

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Everything affects everything, in some way. The point is that you’re attributing too much weight to the supply. The widespread notion of supply and demand curves crossing over each other to determine price is one of the greater hoaxes.

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**Author:** ![monkyyy](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forum.grin.mw/monkyyy/32/1590_2.png) [@monkyyy](https://forum.grin.mw/u/monkyyy)\
**Post date:** [February 4, 2019, 5:30pm UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/140 "2019-02-04T17:30:28Z")

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I don’t nesserily need to believe in that graph to believe in supply and demand.

I consider money to be pseudo ownership in an economy, the supply is the number of shares in it, inflation is a decrease in the price that may be delayed by all the human reasoning flaws but I don’t care for such minor errors, if I can do the simple division problem, so can anyone who will be speculating successfully

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**Author:** ![FirsArgentum](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forum.grin.mw/firsargentum/32/736_2.png) [@FirsArgentum](https://forum.grin.mw/u/FirsArgentum)\
**Post date:** [February 4, 2019, 5:34pm UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/141 "2019-02-04T17:34:36Z")

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I don’t think Roelsmajor was talking about price. S/he was talking about the inflation in supply due to “emmission” i.e. production. There is about 10 times more silver mined (/refined) per annum than gold. That’s what I think s/he was referring to.

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**Author:** ![Abdelaziz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@Abdelaziz](https://forum.grin.mw/u/Abdelaziz)\
**Post date:** [February 4, 2019, 6:22pm UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/142 "2019-02-04T18:22:32Z")

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I like the idea of infinite supply, for a very simple reason, Bitcoin core by the time will only be avaliable to get from the market and it would be very hard to mine, i beleive one of the factors that bitcoin is valuable because it’s hard to mine, but when it becomes impossible then it will lose some of its value, the second thing is 60 grins per second is not too much, around 31.5 m a year is not too much for a currency that will be globally decentralized and accepted as a form of payment.

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**Author:** ![FirsArgentum](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forum.grin.mw/firsargentum/32/736_2.png) [@FirsArgentum](https://forum.grin.mw/u/FirsArgentum)\
**Post date:** [February 4, 2019, 8:17pm UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/143 "2019-02-04T20:17:33Z")

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“…bitcoin is valuable because it’s hard to mine, but when it becomes impossible then it will lose some of its value,…”

If hard to mine =\> valuable  
Then would not easy to mine =\> less valuable  
And impossible to mine =\> invaluable?

I don’t fully follow your logic here.

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**Author:** ![Abdelaziz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@Abdelaziz](https://forum.grin.mw/u/Abdelaziz)\
**Post date:** [February 5, 2019, 6:26am UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/144 "2019-02-05T06:26:20Z")

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Thats my personal opinion and i might be wrong , but i said that for a simple reason, when BTC circulating supply reach the maximum. what would be the difference between btc and a good token with a good use case???  
I mean now we are in 2019, who would prefer to have a monopolized coin while there is a lot of alternatives in the market, especially a community coin that serves the core idea of having a decentralized currency, i am talking about the future not now, but i think the future will affect the current fact. That’s why i said when it reach the maximum supply it will be similar to a token.

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**Author:** ![MerlinsBeard](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex036/user_avatar/forum.grin.mw/merlinsbeard/32/2863_2.png) [@MerlinsBeard](https://forum.grin.mw/u/MerlinsBeard)\
**Post date:** [February 5, 2019, 2:08pm UTC](https://forum.grin.mw/t/emission-rate-of-grin/171/145 "2019-02-05T14:08:16Z")

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If only people would spend a few minutes trying to disprove their own statements before sharing them.

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